IQ testing

[carolyn]

We are starting to get John ready for kindergarten next year. He is due to have an IQ test this spring. The pyschologist called me last night to discuss it, and I have decided not to have it done. He has been in the same preschool classroom for 3 years, with the same teacher. The Kindergarten is in the same building. Both kindergarten teachers (not sure which one will get him) can come in and observe him a few times before next year rolls around to get to know him a little bit. I think that is far more valuable than a test. He was tested when he was 3 and did quite well. I am confident he would score okay this time, but honestly I think it is a waste of time. I think anybody would be able to quickly discern that he still qualifies for special education after 5 minutes of meeting him. I would rather see him get a complete speech eval, which will help his future teacher out way more.
SO, here is my question:
Why oh why are they still doing these cognitive tests on kids? What teacher of any experience at all would put any merit to one versus what his past progress reports and such show?
Just curious for your opinions and experiences.

[christie]

Personally, I think these tests just waste the paper they are written on

CC ~

[YoshsMom]

I agree. No test score has ever told me as much aabout a student as spending time with him and talking to his parents. If I can avoid Yosh taking IQ tests, I will. We start the evaluation process in a couple of weeks since Yosh turns 3 in June. He'll be starting preschool this summer.

[momofrussell]

I don't know about the other states, but in MO, if your child is in spec ed or has an IEP I should say, they HAVE to administer tests by the time the child is 5-6 yrs old for a school age DX. It is more then one test and NOT just some IQ test.

Now, I have never been bothered by the tests. For Russell they did NOT just do some IQ test... they came and observed him, a team approach did their tests and we went from there. I do NOT look at the end result and the numbers. I mean, personally, I don't need someone else to observe my son to tell me where he is mentally.. it's OBVIOUS to me just where he functions....

BUT... I do believe these tests (not JUST an IQ test) are essential for services and to know JUST where your child is at. I look at the tests just as a tool and nothing more. I agree that observations are much more important then the paper tests... but from what I gathered after Russell's tests, is they did both, observe, test and fill out forms. Since Russell is 6, does NOT talk and does NOT follow directions well and does NOT have good receptive language and is low cognitively, without the tests they wouldn't know WHAT to mark on the IEP for his service needs, nor would they know what level he is at.

I DO have to say that our school districts "austism" test was a bit of a joke though... it was some paper test and well, if I or his Ped Nuero were to answer the questions they had about Russell on the test, he WOULD have had a school age DX of Autism.. JUST like the Doctor says... but, they first evaled and tested him for where his "level" was and then said he was doing "level appropriate" behavior.. which would sku that autism test a bit. So they dirived their Autism test results differently then the medical field does.

I wouldn't take creed in the results persay, I would just look at the tests as tools... but that is just my opinoin.

;D

A.

[Jessie]

That's a good way to look at those tests - as simply a tool to help you get what your child needs. I don't think any of us like someone else putting a number on our child!

I know that Jason does worse in those tests than what he does on a regular day - he simply does not like to comply to requests in settings like that. So, I don't think they are reflective of his true abilities, but it does say something about his stubborness and that he does have his OWN mind when it comes to deciding what HE wants to do!


Jessie

[christie]

A~ I wish the teachers in my district thought like you and looked at these tests as a tool and not the end all. But sadly for us that is not the case :-( And honestly, I don't think my district is the only one that thinks that way.

Sad but true, depending on the district, they can twist these tests to suit their needs

Least thats my opinion

CC ~

[carolyn]

I think it is hard to convince me that a test, administered by a virtual stranger, designed to test "normal" intelligence is going to provide any significant data about John. If I thought the test would be a window into his mind, I would do it. If I thought the test would help to construct a method of teaching him, I would do it. I think the testing in general is a relic, and carry over from the old days when they used the data to divide the kids up. I can even see the use to see exactly what is going on with a child without a diagnosis. The speech, sensory processing, ot, pt- all these evals put together provide a clearer picutre of a childs abilities. I would love to see a test done to determine learning styles, so we could focus on How to teach children. I really believe children with Down syndrome are so curious. There just aren't any truisms - the stereotypes I believed before I had him just haven't really panned out. Some things he learns so quickly, others things with one would believe to be a natural extension of the first, are just stalled. It's like his brain is compartmentalized in a different way than most . Some connects flow free, others hit a brick wall.
The key is finding a way to break through, lots of trail and error. John is a great kid. I am so ready for him to go to K and get some independence. He will really have an adjustment from his preschool- A new teacher will challenge him- expectations will be different and i know he can do it.. Like most kids, John chooses the path of least reisistance. He has his current classroom all figured out. It will be interesting that is for certain.

[momofrussell]

Well, in regards to the IQ test alone. I really don't think that test should be the ONLY test they do on our kids. I agree, it would not be the best test for our kids.

Didn't Steffypoo here say they did away with IQ tests in CA? I don't think they can do them in CA anymore.

Carolyn.. is the IQ test the ONLY test they would administer? I just don't see how you can get some good well rounded info on JUST an IQ test... sounds ubsurd.

CC.. sorry your district is like that. And i agree, there are probably many other districts that use the testing in ways it shouldn't be... and how they present it to the parents sometimes.. UHG!

A.

[rickismom]

Actually, all of this is the basis for a big dispute in the world of psycological developement.
Professor Reuvan Feurstein (current living in Israel, but of international aclaim) was a student of Pigot, but took things a bit further, in that he claims that people can be TAUGHT how to think. Years ago, he was working in Israel with new immigrants, many who had been torn away from their original culture. (We learn a lot through cultural mediums.) He proved quite concretely that IQ tests are often not accurate due to cultural connotations. He searched for a way to properly acess children in a way that would not envolve culture. Eventually he came up with the Learning Potential Acessment Device (LPAD). This tool- which takes several hours (ie., a few sittings)-- accesses the potential to learn, not aquired knowledge. Basically, they take several tasks. Eaqch task is given to the student to complete. Then He is taught how to do it correctly. Then he is given another example of the same task. The improvement between the two times show how well they LEARNED. Properly given, the test will let you know what is this students weak points, which his strong ones, so that he can be given targeted intervention.
He has also developed Instrumental Enrichment" (IE) a tool (not music, but an instrument, tool) to help develope decicient cognitive functions. I am currently studying IE and it is really fascinating. IE is for use on children on a third grade level (about). There is a new "Basic IE" for younger learners.

More info:
Israeli English website
www.icelp.org/asp/main.asp

from same website, a form for non-Israelis requeting LPAD assesment.
www.icelp.org/asp/Individual_Assessment.shtm

There are already several people who have studied this. Is you live near a big city, see if there is someone who does it in your area. Alist of places in US that TEACH LPAD (and I would assume that they have lists of their graduates)
www.icelp.org/asp/Authorized_Training_Centers3.asp?id=9

about LAPD
www.icelp.org/asp/Dynamic_Cognitive_Assessment.shtm

[Kristen]

I am not a fan of anything that puts anyone on a "scale". I understand the necessity for it, but I think too many people look at pepaers and not people. If they are able to use it as ONE FACTOR in consideration to srpingboard a conversation, fine by me. I fthey make a person a number, that is the easy way out and defeating the purpose and that happens all too often.