Pre-K Research

[edugatortracy]

Has anyone ever researched Pre-K 'retention'? By retention I mean that a child chronologically should start kindergarten, but is "held back" another year in Pre-K?
James is in a Pre-K program in the public schools and will turn 5 the end of May. Being the ever supportive (LOL) school district - ain't Florida grand?- his staffing specialist is on her soap box about how the district never retains pre-K kids. His teacher, OT, PT, SLP and Behavior specialist all support him staying in Pre-K one more year AND I am Special Ed. certified and know PLENTY about the laws and am ready to fight placement. In the meantime though, I want to do my homework- hence the research question.

Can you tell I have had my caffiene this morning?

Thanks!

BTW, GOOD MORNING!!

Tracy

[Jessie]

Good Morning Tracy,

Yup, I'll all caffeined up and ready to go too!

I don't have relevant experience with a child with Ds and this situation, but my typical niece and also a cousin's daughter both went through Pre-K twice because the teachers felt they weren't ready to go onto Kindergarten. I was thinking the trend is to NOT push a child onto the next level if they are not ready, regardless of age.

I would fight that one too if I were in your shoes!


Jessie

[meghans_mom]

My friend has a son (DS) who turned 5 just 15 days before the cut off date for kindy. they DID have to fight to keep him in preschool another year, but they won. Incidentally, this boy and my meghan have birthdates one day apart but our school cut off dates differ (Dec 1st vs Dec 31st) so Meghan was still able to attend preschool for one more year without a problem.
I have another friend who's daughter (also w/ DS) will turn 5 in November just a week before the cut off date and her school is giving her H-E-C-K about keeping her daughter out for another year.
I think it's hard because May is far away from the cut off date so the school will give you a harder time than if the birthday was closer to the cut off date.
But do I agree that you should fight it? Oh yes...if it comes down to that.
No way would Meghan have been ready for kindy now...and she has surely benefitted from that extra year in preschool.
best of luck & keep us updated! laurie

[Connie]

Tracy,

I didn't realize Indiana and Florida where so close....I really thought they were atleast 1000 miles apart but I must be wrong because their views on sending kids to Kindergarten are the same.

Here in Indiana a child does not have to be in a forrmal educational setting until they are 7. So that means you do not have to send your child to kindergarten until then. Well, lets just say last year my district tried to tell me because of funding Collin (who's birthday is 2/1/00) had to go to Kindergarden!!! He would have been in kindergarden at 5yrs and was not ready. They told me he had to go on because of funding.

Well, if you know me this DID NOT go over well considering I work for the government and know that you cannot decide not to do something (placement included) based on money/lack of funding if it is written into law that you provide it.

I called the State Board of Educations and got all of my ducks in line before the IEP to trasition Collin into Kindergarden. When I went in I listened to all they had to say then politely told her that I have been in contact with the state office and she cannot make me send Collin on to Kindergarden until he is 7 even if there is a funding issue and went through all the laws with her. She asked me to get this for her in writing. I told her NO if it is different it is your place to provide it to me in writing and prove to me I am wrong!!

Long story short, she back peddled and said because his birthday was after 12/31 he could stay in preschool one more year!!!

He switched preschool...which is a whole different thread and story. This has made the world of difference for Collin!!! Last year Collin had some behavior issues with the teachers at school (I did not have them at home) but this year he has changed so much. On Tues and Thurs he is in a special ed class but on M, W, F he is in a regular ed class with 25 children and no aid and is thriving!!!

Connie

[cindylou]

Tracy-
Your child is entitled to school services through the age of 21. All you need to tell them is that you want the extra years of academics used at the beginning of his school career-since that is when the foundational information is taught-rather then post-graduation. If you went to due process I am quite sure you would win with this one. Had I to do it over again I would've done this--but now that Kaylee is 12 and well established in her peer relationships I think it would become detrimental for her to be retained (at least in the social aspect-peer support). Kindergarten is the perfect age for retention and when they say "we have a policy of not retaining children" remind them that your childs iep is to be individualized-to meet James' needs-and if he need another year of K so that he will be more successful in 1st--You keep arguing that point. Don't give them any room-And if you have the support of almost everyone on the team-then that sounds like a majority on the IEP.

[edugatortracy]

In Florida, the law is that you have to be 5 prior to September 1st to start Kindergarten. Regardless, his AGE doesn't dictate his NEEDS. Oh, I am ready to battle-and with the support of his team, I am not worried about it too much. I appreciate all the experiences everyone provided!

Have a great day!

[Connie]

Tracy,

In Indiana you have to be 5 by (oh they keep moving it...so this may have changed) August 1st to be eligilble to attend/start kindergarden. This does not mean you have to send them. They only have to be in a formal education setting by age 7 wether that be homeschooling or regular kindergarten.

You may check to see if Florida's law reads something like that, too. Her there are a lot of parents that choose to send there kids to Kindergarten as a 6 year old (especially boys).

Connie

[mommygwen]

IEP means INDIVIDUAL Education Plan.
I held my son back in kindergarden because he wasn't ready for more than a half day. Then when he did go to first grade the following year I was often told that he misbehaved in the afternoon. It took awhile for him to learn to manage the full school day; but he finially did.
You know what is best for you child and your gut feeling is based on thousands of hours of observation. Fight if you need to, or just tell the IEP team that you want to review the plan at home with your family and will get back to the team with your decision on the fellowing day.

[Emilysmom]

Tracy,
Cindy said it SO well............YOU know James, you know what he needs. GO for it, and help the team to see it. It would be in their best interest too, because it would be getting him off on the right foot for kindy later! I hope and pray they will listen to reason.

My daughter went to pre K for two years, and to Kindy for two years. She didn't start 1st grade until she right after she turned EIGHT!!!! But, no one argued with me about it, and it was VERY good for her.

Susan

[chasesmom]

You all need to move here to Michigan as your kiddos can go to school until they are age 26, only state left in the US that still believes in this hence....that is why have the job I have working at the post secondary level. And kids can go to kindy as long as they turn 5 before December 31.
WhenI tell you what we did for Chase, remember he is ADHD with LOTS of energy
He went to preschool thru age 3 and 4 and when he turned five he went to preschool in the am and half day kindy in the pm and then the next year he did another round of kindergarten which was by far his best year and I still think the year before really got him ready for it. But as Susan said Tracy, no one knows James like you do and silly them messing with someone who knows the special ed system, they'll figure out the errors of their ways eventually
hugs, Robin

[hidyperson]

Just a question Connie ( not a brawl indicator ) "you cannot decide not to do something (placement included) based on money/lack of funding if it is written into law that you provide it. "

Am I reading this right ? If there are no resources , the law says they have to it anyways ? - Puzzled Jeff

[Connie]

WHAT!!! YOUR QUESTIONING ME!!! HOW DARE YOU!!!!......LOL just teasing but I had to poke the bear!!! It's in my nature!!

Ok....very hard to explain over the internet. But here we go. I work for a local governmental office in charge of overseeing the poor and by law we are required to provide certain basic necessities of life if a person/family qualifies. We are one of 5 units of government supported by the local property tax base....State, City, County, Township and School. These are the only 5 groups in Indiana that are allowed to levy taxes. For example...say we had a bad winter and we had a lot of request for utility assistance which depleated our budget. If someone else came in an made a request and qualified we could not tell them sorry we are out of money we would have to ask for additional appropriation or take out a bond to cover their needs. Just because we run out of money does not releive or obligations to follow the law. The same thing goes with the school district. Just because they say they do not have funding does not releive them of their resposibilities. The only thing that can do this is a legislative bill that is passed into law.

Hope that helps!!
Connie

[hidyperson]

Thanks Connie - it's informative, but I think I'm still missing it, if there is no money, where does the money come from ? And if there is a source of money , how can you you be out of it.... Or is it it just 'that budget is bust' and there are outside sources - Jeff who's trying, but he thinks in terms of zoology, not economics

[Connie]

Ok,

Each year we have to set our buget. To cover our budget we get our money from the tax base but we are only allowed to tax so much. A certain % of the property base. If for some reason we would exceed the amount bugeted/or allocated through the taxes we would have to go to the states and file a bond and ask for additional propriations. A bond is like a loan that has to be paid back. I told you it was hard to explain over the internet plus I'm not good at explaining it!!

Connie

[hidyperson]

I think you're doing a great job ! So I'd guess that too many bonds/loans could be a problem in the long run, or cause the need to reevaluate the budget because of a higher need.

I think what's in the back of my head is - what happens when the money isn't there ? I kind of get the impression ( not just in this scenario but everywhere ) that people think the government always has the money and just isn't forking it over. I'm Canada ( Western ) and have been reading about the closure of institutions in Ontario at a communitylingontario.ca site. I don't disagree with what they're doing, but every week they want more money for something. As a bystander I'm fascinated as they seem to be getting it - but I'm waiting for the announcement that the 'jam jar is now empty'.


Anyways, thanks for filling this in, I've been wondering about this concept "you cannot decide not to do something based on money/lack of funding " for ages. Thanks again ! - Jeff