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Post by Chester on Jan 9, 2007 20:39:34 GMT -5
I'm all on board with accountability, natural consequences, closing my little man. JT's loop holes of manipulation, whatever it may be called.
The flop and drop has to be on the top of my list of things that are just not okay, and I obviously have been leaving loop holes for JT because they still happen.
Today, he flopped and dropped on me when we were trying to get into the car. The parking lot was wet and really dirty, it almost made me sick, but I let him go. I didn't stop him or pick him up. After a few good flops I said very calmly 'wow it's wet and ishy' he stopped and looked at his pants and got up saying 'ish'. I said yes the parking lot is ishy. (the whole time I'm thinking GREAT....WE"VE GOT ONE MORE FLIPPIN" STOP AND NOW YOU LOOK ISHY, I am so hyper aware of how he looks and don't want to let anyone think that kids with DS are dirty.)
No more flop and drops today after the parking lot incident. So tomorrow when I take him to school and he flops when we reach the door, what's the natural consequence?! The flop is over avoidance. It's not me ignoring him until he's ready, He'd love that.
Pretty soon, I'm not going to be able to physically pick the almost 50 lb bugger up. Especially when he tightens every muscle in his body and doesn't bend....sigh.
Any and all suggestions are welcome!
Dawn
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Post by ashleysmom on Jan 9, 2007 20:51:12 GMT -5
Ashley who is also 4 flops all the time. We now just grab her hand and say Ashley get up. If she does not I just take her hand and drag her until she gets to her feet, In the summer with shorts it stops pretty fast but the winter she's in pants.
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Post by Jessie on Jan 9, 2007 20:51:52 GMT -5
Ok, first, what's "ishy" Second, again I don't know if it was just Jason's time to grow out of this wonderful, beautiful stage of life or not, but I'll share what we did. When we were on the way somewhere we explained to him what we were doing and that when it was time to leave that place he needed to mind us (or something along those lines). If he didn't and threw a fit he was going to get something taken away from him. I think it only happened that first time - he got his GameBoy or something very important to him taken away - just like we said he would. He has not done that since. We told him specifically what he would lose, he lost it and that was that. Jessie
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Post by Chester on Jan 9, 2007 20:58:15 GMT -5
ishy=icky, bleakey, rude, dirty, ishkibbles
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Post by Jessie on Jan 9, 2007 20:59:19 GMT -5
LOL!!! Ishkibbles . . . where are you from Dawn?!!! LOL
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Post by Chester on Jan 9, 2007 21:04:24 GMT -5
ishkibbibbles....that's probably a closer spelling. Can't say I've ever spelt it before, but I say it a lot.
I'm from Minnesota, could be a scandinavian word, now that you mention it. I haven't heard one person down here in KY use the word.
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Post by Kristin on Jan 9, 2007 22:28:58 GMT -5
It helped to take the time to warn Clarice we were going somewhere. For some reason she needed this. She does better if I tell her what is happening and give her time to process it. When she was littler, I used to try dragging her, but as she got heavier it became more of an issues. I ended up choosing my times to battle, and just tell her "okay" and turn my back on her. The idea is to cut off the attention.
I still do this if I'm picking her up from daycare and she doesn't want to leave. I just tell her "I'm leaving" and start walking for the door. She usually gets up and runs for her backpack, and then the door.
On a side note, one day I was picking her up and she wanted to stay at the daycare and play longer. I told her, "Don't you want to come home and make pizza for dinner with me?" Instantly two of the other children in the daycare came running up to me and said "Take me home, I love pizza!". Clarice beamed, picked up her backpack, and went with me.
The good news is...I think our kids do out grow it. Clarice hasn't done the flop and drop in a long time. (However, my 4 year old still does!)
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Post by MB on Jan 9, 2007 22:56:02 GMT -5
If anyone gets a handle on the flop and drop, first run it by an Intellectual Property attorney so you can own the rights and make millions of dollars!
mb
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Post by CC on Jan 9, 2007 23:51:07 GMT -5
YUP Chris too was a flop and drop OMG totally drove me nuts ALTHOUGH I would not show Chris it did. But Grrrrr to that, Really what is up with that flop and drop stuff What we do due was for us it became so much of a problem, we MADE that our only issue to deal with for a bit. We let all else go and just DEALT with that issue. Took a bit but really not to bad. I use to panic cause he would due the flop thing at the most inconvenient times, KWIM like say when the bus came and I would kind of panic like man the bus is waiting. Then I realized so what if the bus is waiting, not the end of the world I would time him out, which for him at this time worked ;D I will be honest, if the bus was waiting I may have timed him not as long but with Chris just the fact or time out was all that mattered, not like he counted the seconds LOL I also told the driver of the bus if we are not outside the second you pull up, hang in there, cause we are working on this behavior and they just waited for us, which for me relieved the stress KWIM I also for Chris, as I stated in another post here use to be way to wordy with him I tend t talk very fast to begin with and I would be like "Chris the bus, get your coat, you backpack, come on the bus, lets go NOW and bla bla bla... He would just shut down and flop. My g/f said to me OMG SHUT UP just tell him the bus. Hmmm seem tooo simple to me LOL But I did and counted to 7 in my head before I said one other word to him and you know for HIM it worked. Not just in the bus area but in every area he flopped. I will be totally honest here, Chris is 14 and every now and then out of a blue moon he will pull that and I just say "Chris ! 2 and before I get to 3 he is up ;D K, thats our experience with flop and drop CC ~
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Post by Claire on Jan 10, 2007 0:11:31 GMT -5
Boy Oh Boy! Don't know what is going on but it seems like everytime I come on Uno Mas I realize either Adam is either reading these post or he is going through 10 different stages all at once. First it was the dressing issue, then the bahavior one and now this. Adam does that one too. The teachers are having this problem also as he will either not get up to dress or refuses to come back in from recess. And you are right when he decides he isn't getting up, you need to be at least 200 pounds to be able to lift him. He weighes 85 pounds but when he flops himself it feels more like 150. We have tried the grabbing his hand and firmly saying lets go but we are not able to pull him for fear of dislocation. He is very hypotonic and very loose joints. We learned what they call the Basket Hold but I am told it is now illegal. The school tries bribing him, (doesn't work) and I don't beleive in it. I want Adam to listen to us because he does, not because their may be something in it for him at the end of the road. I read some of the replies and some are good, some are funny, especialy the one for Ashley. ;D So I'll keep readinf this thread and keep Adam away from the computer for a while. Just in case. ;D ;D
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Post by MB on Jan 10, 2007 18:29:42 GMT -5
O.K. I'm guessing none of our kids flop and drop on the way to their favorite activity whether that be recess, a bubble bath at home, to the airport to go to Disney etc... Please reply to this question.
Why do you think your child flops and drops?
MB thinks either avoidance or overwhelmed. Maybe if we all look at this as a group, we will come up with some solution? O.K. everybody, outside the box, here we go!!!!
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Post by momofrussell on Jan 10, 2007 18:43:27 GMT -5
Well, Russell doesn't do it often but for him, it would be a tranistion thing... where he was having to stop doing what he was doing and didn't want to or we were going somewhere he didn't want to...like if we drive somewhere and when we stop he tends to have fits. I don't consider it an "issue" for us though because I don't make it an issue. If Russell does this while I am shopping I do one of two things depending on the situation. The first thing I do is make him get up and walk with me hand and hand, I tell him to walk and he walks, crying at all. Sometimes he is hysterical or just wants to really try to get his way and drop and cry and well, to be honest I don't have time for it so if he won't walk, I will pick him up and do what I need to do and/or put him in his stroller. I am not opposed to getting my stuff done while a crying little boy is in the stroller or cart. I need to get things done, he can cry all he wants LOL An example of this is a few months ago we (whole family) headed to Toys R Us and then we need to go next door to Petsmart. Well, for some reason Russell was upset we even GOT into the car let alone stopped at a place that didn't look like home. THIS is VERY common for us. We went into Toys R Us and Kevin did his best to occupy Russell with the Thomas The Train set up while I did some quick shopping with the girls. Russell STILL wasn't happy because he'd rather be stimming at home with music or dangling a blanket or both. My take is that boy needs to get out of the HOUSE and stop stimming sometimes. So.... girls and I are wrapping up what we are doing and Russell has had enough. I told Kevin to head to Petsmart, we head to the checkout and we will meet them. Wellllll.. I get outside and see Kevin with Russell in the car. Kevin said "you girls go in, Russell is not happy and just hurry up and we will go home". I overrode that option and said (while getting Russell back out of the car) "We came out as a family, the girls want to show you sometihng in Petsmart and Russell will just have to deal with it". I picked Russell up and we put him in a shopping cart and he sniveled and cried while we walked around Petsmart. Then when we got what we needed we went home... and Russell survived the event... even if mommy is mean You know... with the flop and drop...it's like a temper tantrum for me in my house and I just don't have time for them. I don't even have time to ATTEMPT to stop the behavior.. I figure what works best is if I keep going on what I need to do and that is that. NOW... that said.. there ARE times Russell is not doing well and having a fit and it's NOT for stubborn reasons...we have learned to tell the difference. The times that he is over stimulated or is having SUCH fits due to lack of input, whatever... (the autism part of Russell), we DO have to leave situations sometimes... it's like he is physically and mentally hurt and upset and we need to rectify the situation. We've had to omit or quit activities due to this. But this behavior is different then the good ole flop and drop due to stubbornness. Reece is kinda the same way on a different level so I have learned when they are being poopoo heads and when they are truly on overload. So.. I don't have a solution to offer.. I just know how I deal with it and it works for us a.
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Post by Jessie on Jan 10, 2007 19:18:25 GMT -5
Usually it was when he simply didn't want to do something - like leaving his grandma's house, for example. To me it's like a toddler temper tantrum. Definitely has to do with avoidance of doing something that's expected.
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Post by Emilysmom on Jan 10, 2007 19:31:40 GMT -5
MB: Emily has, of course, done the "flop and drop" over the last 15 years........although, thankfully not all that often! But get this! Last night, I told her it was time for her to take a shower. She tried to bargain with me......begging to take a bubble bath, instead. Her bubble baths take FOREVER, and she really needed to go to bed. So, I said "Sorry....this time you need to take a SHOWER". I turned and walked away, assuming she would frown but go ahead and take her shower. And the little punk literally flopped on the ground and put her face on the carpet! I was like..........."oh no you didn't"!!! I said "Emily, tomorrow is TEENSIDE (her church youth group where they go out to eat together and do something fun). You can not go to Teenside without a clean body and clean hair. PERIOD." Then I went on to do some laundry. Next thing I know, I heard the shower running. No arguing. No pleading. And no bubble bath for her. I'm fairly sure she called me a bad name while in the shower. But, she was all smiles when she got out! So yes..........avoidance and frustration had to be her "excuse".
Susan
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Post by trishasmom on Jan 10, 2007 19:34:18 GMT -5
While there can be many reasons for the flop and drop not always is it behavioral as in avoidance or just being non-compliant. Sometimes it could be physical. With Trisha's hypotonia she has lots of problems with her legs and hips. She flops mostly when she is tired or standing on her legs to long. I highly recommend having their hip sockets checked periodically to make sure that they are not being worn down from the way they walk and use their legs. I realize not all children with DS has that much of a problem with the hypotonia but it doesnt' hurt to check to make sure. With high tolerance to pain by the time they are showing pain they could have completely worn their sockets out and I know that has happened before. Trisha still has an immature gait and being overweight doesn't help either. We use a wheelchair when there will be alot of walking and that has been a life saver on my poor worn back. Trisha will flop and drop even if it's something she wants to do when her body has had enough walking. So just to caution it may not always be a negative behavior but a physical one. JMHO
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