Help, Noah is so stubborn and pissed!!!!

[faithhope]

We just took Noah to his first speech/feeding therapy. I didn't go cause I am sick, but Shawn said Noah did well. IT is only a 1/2 hour session. We are going to try to get it to be an hour once a week, half hour is too quick.
Anyways the therapist suggested that we wean Noah from the bottle ( he is 11 mos. old, btw.) and gave us a homemade bottle from a honey bear that has a small straw like tube. I hope tha tmakes sense.
Has anyone ever used that on their child. The point is to get him to pucker his lips closer together ( like whistling) and it should help with his tongue positioning ( ? I think). She said that once Noah is off the bottle he should start saying his first words.
Also with food, we have beengiving him stage 3 chunky foods for just a few months and he still gets sensitive with it and chokes but that is our fault becuase we started so late on that and were not consistent.
So my questions, sorry so long.
What did you do for your babies? Did you notice any difference or correlation between weaning from bottle and them speaking.
Please any advice you can give would be great.
Oh I forgot to mention that Noah gets soooooooo angry, frustrated when we try to give him milk with the honey bear bottle thingy, he refuses it! I don't know what to do and how far to take it.
Also he is going to an ENT specialist next month becuase he didn't do to great on his right ear hearing eval a couple of weeks ago. He has some middle ear fluid, so I need to do things for that also.
Any helpful advice on that?
OK enough already,
Thanks,
Jess

[Googsmom aka Jennifer]

Jess I have no advice. I have {{{{{HUGS}}}}} Bad mommy me has been told 100x's to get Brook off the bottle. Sadly she is still having her bottle b/c of some swallowing issues. She can drink from a straw BUT spits it right back out on the momma. She gets too much in her mouth I thought so I only put little drinks in the cup but spit, spit and more spit We tried the sippy but again she gets to much liquid and it comes out her nose and she chokes. I am at a loss as to how to transition from bottle to cup myself. {{{{HUGS}}}} for Noah as he goes to the ENT doctor. Prayers they can help him hear better

[damarasmom]

Well, I don't know that I agree with the speaking when off the bottle. This did NOT happen with Damara. We took her off bottle I would say about 1ish, went to sippy cups and the straw came much later. She just couldn't make her lips tighten around the straw. Good luck with the ENT visit, I hope all goes well!

[Emilysmom]

Jess,
Emily was weaned just before her first birthday, and was drinking from a regular straw at 12 months. I've heard lots of people talk about the honey bear straw thingy, and they say it works well to get the baby ready. The whole idea is that the muscles in the lips, inner cheeks, tongue are SO important for speech, and they need to be worked (those muscles) in the right way.

I would highly recommend an eval by Debra Beckman. We took Emily for an eval with her last summer and I was very impressed. She is in Winter Park, Winter Haven, or Winter something.........about 30 minutes from Orlando. It was WELL worth our drive from TN to see her. She is SO good with developing good muscle control for speech.
I can give you more info on her if you'd like.

It's the same as with any other new habit..............switching Noah from a bottle to any kind of straw/cup thing is going to take some getting used to! But he can do it!!! I'm sure the ST will help in any way she can.

Hang in there,
Susan

[faithhope]

Thanks you guys! Very insightful. I think it does help but ultimately it is not the only thing that will help or determine future speech. Oh and Susan if you read this, I would love more info on Debra Beckman.
I will PM you.

[momofcourt]

Hi Jess,
It's been a while since I posted, so I will introduce myself to you. My name is Valerie and I have a daughter Courtney that will be 7 in January that had DS.

I nursed her until she was 14 months, but I introduced the sippy cup at 9 months. She hated it and it took 4 to 5 month before she was really good at dirking out of it.
As far as the straw went, for us it is kind of a funny way it happened, but I was at the mall and forgot her sippy so I purchased a juice box with a straw and put it to her mouth and she drank from it. I think she was around a year old.

I saw that you live in Florida, I live in Gainesville Fl. I want to mention a Clinic in Jacksonville, Hope Haven. They evaluate people of all ages with DS. They have a website as well. If your interested let me know and I will post more info.

BTW I have been following your post off and on since you had Noah. He is beautiful.

Good luck and take care,
Valerie

[sandi]

Gee.... my opinion..... weaning off the bottle at 11 months? HOLY. I wouldnt do it. Cassie is 19 months and still takes a bottle. At 18 months, she started on a cup with a straw. I give her water in it and she has it beside her all day. She can drink from it whenever she wants. I give her water in it cause she will spit it out and make a mess, and she needs the water. A friend of mine weaned her DS child off the breast and on to a straw just over a year. I havent heard about any baby who started to talk after being weaned. Hmmmm. I have to question that. Yes my workers had said whenever I can, to get her to start on a straw, but never demanded when. It is part of speech and the muscles in her mouth/lips. But holy, to do that now at 11 months. Geeeee. We all have to make our own decisions for our children. I would still give him his bottle, but also every now and then introduce the straw cup. He will do it on his own one day. My opinion though. If I really wanted to, I could take the bottle away from Cassie because she does drink out of a straw. But she really enjoys her bottle, even though, she doesnt drink a full bottle. One day, I will just decide to say, no more bottle, and here is your straw cup. I guess, I like to see her get her milk/fluids. Everyone has their own opinions and their own ways. Cassie says, nana papa, mama dada, baby, and her mumble words,,,:-) She will mimic you really good, and when the workers were here for speech, they said bucket, and she said it. We were so surprised. She is saying 2 and 3 syllables. The one thing my speech therapist would like to see Cassie do more of, is to drink out of a normal cup. No sippy, and no straw. She wants us to do this at least once a day. Our therapists dont like the sippy cup at all, and have asked us not to use this with her. Its like sucking out of a bottle they said, and they want her to use her lips like a normal drinking cup. Little sips at a time. You could start Noah doing that now if you wanted to try.

[laurasnowbird]

Hey there girl!

I've been on the road working, and not able to post, but I saw your thread and had to respond. (Now if I can just get it done before my next client, LOL!)

We used the honey bear with Ethan, got it from Sara Rosenfeld-Johnson, whose methods are like Beckman's, lots of emphasis on oral-motor skills. (Her website is Talk Tools) We started Ethan at about 10 months, and he was waaay reluctant to use it. It helped to squeeze the bear's tummy so that the liquid would start to come out, and he "got it" that there was milk in that thing. We went cold turkey and had a couple of dicey days, but it worked out very well in the end.

Your therapist is right about how helpful it is to use a straw. Try this: pretend you are sucking from a straw and notice what your tongue does, it automatically retracts. That is great practice for strengthening the muscles that prevent tongue protrusion. We truly don't have ANY tongue protrusion with Ethan unless he is tired and purposely sucking his tongue. Otherwise, we never see it.

We've done a lot of oral-motor work, and one of the nicest compliments we ever received about Ethan came from a therapist who wanted to know what kind of "surgery" we had elected for Ethan. I was puzzled, and thought she'd noticed the scar from his duodenal bypass on his belly. She said no, she didn't mean that, she wanted to know what we'd had done to his face. Huh? I told her that we hadn't had any surgery done to his face, and she said "oh my gosh, look at him, he has a strong jawline and cheekbones....how did you do that?" The light bulb went on, and I described the oral motor work we'd done with him. She was sold.

We were at one of those phases where Ethan was being difficult about his therapy, and it was SOOOO affirming to hear her comments, really gave me the strength to push through his denials at that time.

As far as those darn stage 3 foods, we've been told by more than one therapist that those are really confusing for kids with oral motor issues or any texture sensitivity. Mixed textures are hard for kids to deal with (even kids without disabilities) because part of it can just be swallowed, and part of it has to be chewed. Does that make sense? We were advised to avoid those mixed textures altogether until Ethan was older and better able to handle those. At almost seven years old, his favorite thing is homemade potato and ham soup, which is definitely a mixed texture and shows you how far he's come from those days. (We had the gagging issues going on too!!)

I have some thoughts about those ears too, but will have to get back to this as I'm out of time for now. HUGS to you....it will be OK. We REALLY struggled with this when Ethan was young, he was the king of gag and vomit, and now he eats beautifully! Seriously, the kid eats broccoli and asparagus, and fish, all kinds of stuff!!!! It will come and you're getting great advice. I would seriously look into some oral-motor exercises with Beckman if she's near you, or someone skilled with Sara Rosenfeld-Johnson's techniques.

[faithhope]

Hey Thank you all for the wonderful responses. I am taking teh advice from all of your experiences.
Let me share the newest. Noah actually grabbed teh honey bear on his own, put it to his mouth and sipped, all on his own. He was in a good mood. i know not to push him. When he got annoyed, I gave him the rest in his bottle. Every little bit, little by little. It does make sense though, I really want him to be able to speak one day and he needs to strengthen those muscles and get that tongue in place.
OK I am a little busy, so get back later.
Love,
Jess